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Garden Queen
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:19 am |
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More on Beliefs (Part 2/3)
Posted: 28 Jun 2009 12:17 AM PDT
Sometimes people only respond to feelings and vote for political candidates who reflect them. But often they vote for an idea that reflects their underlying needs and feelings: e.g., "This man will make our country safe." We can ignore the reality of what he does because his rhetoric soothes apprehensions and salves fear. But of course, the leader has to first install fear — the enemy is planning secret attacks. Then, I will protect you by arming heavily. "Yes, yes I will vote for more and more arms so I can feel safe." Too often individuals vote their feelings in the guise of an idea. The more neurotic (heavily repressed) a person is, the greater the distance between his ideas and feelings — what I call the Janovian gap — the more symbolic her ideas
. By neurotic I mean someone with a high degree of imprinted, blocked pain that distorts the whole system physically and psychologically. It is not just that someone has far-out ideas. They are linked into a major system. They have anchors into a personality. There are certain traumas imprinted in the system that require repression, and the interplay between them is the hub of neurosis. The outcome of that interaction, the resulting symptoms, is what we generally call neurosis. Belief systems are just another form of symptoms. They do not spring full blown out of the air. There are historical causes. Once we understand this, we can see how one can give up drugs and booze in favor of being born-again; ideas smother the pains just as well as, if not better than, drugs. That is why those who are unwell will tend to fall ill prematurely, stricken by an internal reality of which they are not aware. The more warped the ideas, the more likely the person will have a warped physiology, and vice versa.
It isn’t just ideas we are dealing with; it is a whole human being whose ideas reflect his buried needs and feelings. Twisted ideas and beliefs, in my view, presage a shorter lifespan. The system is neurotic not just one’s beliefs. In psychoanalysis and cognitive therapy they tend to help change ideas without realizing that they part and parcel of a human, and a human with a history. And of course, there are the various tests for progress in therapy usually of the verbal variety so that if one says one is better, one is considered better. Or on certain questions, "Are you more comfortable with yourself now after therapy?
" We see that the more one is defended and thereby feels more comfortable, the more progress we consider the patient has made. Key psychological factors lead people into belief systems, cults and self-destructive situations. The Arab suicide bombers, the followers at Waco and Jonestown were in the grip of something much stronger and much older than reason and good judgment. They were victims, first, of a culture that extolled death and the hereafter. That is: We don’t die; we just go on in a different form. Thus death is rather meaningless. They were also victims of basic unfulfilled need; the need that meant survival early on.
A matrix of unconscious feelings and unending neediness impelled the suicide bombers, People’s Temple and Heaven's Gate members and the Branch Davidians to search for what had been deprived them in childhood, even though they had forgotten and, for the most part, had no memory of the existence of such needs.
Deprived childhood need (the need to be caressed, soothed, valued, loved) had driven them into the hands of an equally needy demagogue who had promised them fulfillment; in return they would follow, adore and deify the leader.
Each cult member is as naive, needy and vulnerable as an infant turning toward its mother for warmth, sustenance, protection and guidance.
They look like adults but they are basically babies.
http://cigognenews.blogspot.com/2009/06/more-on-beliefs-part-23.html
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*Phil*
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:07 pm |
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The Bible documents that longevity and physical health are a function of good spiritual health:
Deuteronomy 34:7 Moses was 120 years old when he died, but his eyes had not dimmed, and his natural powers had not left him.
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Pecca fortiter, sed fortius fide et gaude in Christo!
Galactic Signature: Blue Self-Existing Monkey
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Garden Queen
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:13 pm |
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| Phil, thank you! It 's in black and white isn't it?!!!Amazing.
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*Phil*
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 02:45 pm |
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I had detected that Janov displayed just a wee bit of hubris that needed poking. Longevity didn't arrive with modern medicine and psychiatry. Longevity seems to me a timeless feature of civilization, healthy living, and solid spirituality. On the other hand sometimes you've just got to see a doctor ( or shaman, bone-setter, etc.) because they are very good at some things and delay might put an abrupt end to an individual's plans of happy longevity.
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Pecca fortiter, sed fortius fide et gaude in Christo!
Galactic Signature: Blue Self-Existing Monkey
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Roy
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Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 02:27 am |
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Janov also acts as if the Spirit doesn't exist, only neurons. He has no psychology of identity and what experience means, how meaning comes into being, something like Jung.
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"The force and degree of a man's inner benevolence evokes in others a proportionate degree of ill-will" - Gurdjieff
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." — George Orwell
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*Phil*
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Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 02:11 pm |
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Janov got a spanking here. LOL
Garden Queen hasn't written what she thought about Janov's article.
Jung gave a good start on the study of Logos and Telos, it is a shame that professionals ever since have largely ignored those and focused elsewhere or on the Eros and Soul aspect of the psyche.
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Pecca fortiter, sed fortius fide et gaude in Christo!
Galactic Signature: Blue Self-Existing Monkey
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Roy
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Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 09:27 pm |
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Got a link or a book on that Logos and Telos?
____________________
"The force and degree of a man's inner benevolence evokes in others a proportionate degree of ill-will" - Gurdjieff
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." — George Orwell
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Garden Queen
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Posted: Fri Jul 3rd, 2009 04:54 pm |
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GARDEN QUEEN HAS BEEN USING THOSE SCIENTISTS.
G Q NEEDS ALL THE PRAYERS SHE CAN GET NOW. YOU CAN BET NO DR. ASKED ME WHAT WAS GOING ON IN MY LIFE. ..IN THE EMERGENCY ROOM.
I KNOW THE MEANING . IF I DON'T KNOW IT I KNOW THERE IS ONE. NO ACCIDENTS
I SHOULD HAVE SAID ..."THIS IS NOT AN ACCIDENT..IT IS PYCHE SENDING ME A SHOCK...LISTEN...LISTEN...TO MY HEART.
CAN U IMAGINE WHAT THE DR. WOULD HAVE SAID.. HE WAS INTERESTED IN CHATTING WITH MY BEAUTIFUL DAUGHTER//...!!!!. FOR HIS WORK IS 'BORING'...ETC...UNLESS HE IS REALLY SETTING BONES AND MAKING A DIFFERENCE OF HEALING
Last edited on Fri Jul 3rd, 2009 04:56 pm by Garden Queen
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Roy
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Posted: Fri Jul 3rd, 2009 06:34 pm |
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So, how is the recovery from the fall going? Much pain?
____________________
"The force and degree of a man's inner benevolence evokes in others a proportionate degree of ill-will" - Gurdjieff
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." — George Orwell
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*Phil*
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Posted: Sun Jul 12th, 2009 07:31 pm |
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Garden Queen. I have a sacred Psalm for your upcoming journey:
A thousand fall at your side, and ten thousand to your right,
but you will not be touched.
No evil will befall you, no curse will fall upon your tent;
your angels will be given orders regarding you,
to protect you along your every way.
____________________
Pecca fortiter, sed fortius fide et gaude in Christo!
Galactic Signature: Blue Self-Existing Monkey
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